| « Downloads to Spare? Try The Éthiopiques Series | In Their Own Write: 2000 Man Tells Us How to Stay Chick Free in a Rock 'n Roll World » |
Why Is Pavement Thought of More Highly Than Solo Malkmus?
07/31/07 | by Mr. Moderator
Granted, the way this question is asked can easily be dismissed as "ridiculous" (or worse), but think of it this way: Can Malkmus' work in Pavement be seen as a training ground for what he's begun to do with his solo career?
Follow up:
If you haven't been subjected to my ravings over the past couple of years for Malkmus' Face the Truth, you may still be scratching your head. "We're talkin' about Pavement," one of our indie-rock friends might say, "Pavement! We're not talkin' about Polvo; we're talkin' about Pavement!" I like some Pavement, especially the Wowee Zowee album, but they've always sounded scattered and rickety. Let's face the truth: they often sounded like they were dicking around. Maybe I had to be their age and dicking around in a like manner, but I don't recall fully digging some equivalent to Pavement during my dicking-around days. (I spell M...A, child...!)
On his own, maybe more comfortable in his skin, playing most of the instruments himself, Malkmus' sly, stoner strengths come to the fore without as many self-conscious displays of silliness. In other words, there's not so much dicking around. We often like our rock 'n rollers pimply and sporting a 24-hour hard on, as my friend E. Pluribus Gergely might put it, but I'm all right with an artist learning how to make love to the music.
There's a song on Face the Truth called "Post-Paint Boy", and it sure sounds like a commentary on his own younger career - and maybe what he's pushing againt in his present works as well. It's good stuff, put forth at just the right tone. I'm going to say it verifies what I've been thinking about this guy's career trajectory.
As points of comparison, look at Frank Black and Paul Simon. I feel like Black has been pushing to fulfill whatever he could barely do in The Pixies all those years ago, although Black's not yet near the master of his mature self. An example of an artist who was strong in his pimply days but grew stronger as he entered MANhood is Paul Simon. Hold hands with your high school sweetheart and listen to "Homeward Bound", but grab the keys, pop in "50 Ways to Leave Your Lover", and head directly for the heart of highway traffic while you make the long drive to the office. I'd be willing to bet Townsman Mwall has an inkling of what I'm talking about.
18 comments
Comment from: sally_cinnamon [Member] 
Mr. Mod - I don't know what you mean!!! I love Pavement. I actually love Pavement more than I love Malkmus' post career, but I do love Malkmus, just not as much - it's just not AS exciting as Pavement was. You need to hear Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain, Slanted & Enchanted and also Terror Twilight (their last album before the split) and one of my favourites "Brighten the Corners" - it's all a bit different, I think their catalogue lies in their experimentation and their ability to get a little kid-like in the whole experience - that's what made them Pavement. The screaming, the mess, the whole she-bang.
08/01/07 @ 12:44
Comment from: sally_cinnamon [Member]
By the way - LOVE that Space Ghost clip! Awesome!!
08/01/07 @ 12:45
Comment from: sally_cinnamon [Member]
Oh! And - where is Mr. Clean on this issue? After I made him the Pavement comps, I wonder if he agrees - or if he's heard Malkmus' stuff...
08/01/07 @ 12:45
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
I figure the sloppy, experimental, kid thing is a big part of Pavement's appeal, but I think you were only getting a fraction of Malkmus in the process. What I like about his solo stuff is that he's filtered out much of the nonsense. He's who he's become. For some artists, that's a very scary notion and often leads to Automatically Sucking, but I think, dare I say it, that the Malkmus of Face the Truth is Stephen Malkmus...The Way His Music Was Meant to Sound!
08/01/07 @ 13:28
Comment from: sally_cinnamon [Member]
Mr. Mod - I don't have Face the Truth - but maybe it's on emusic and in listening to it, it will give me an idea of where you're coming from on this. I still hope that Dean can chime in here on his thoughts. I'll give that album a listen and report back! I only have Pig Lib and his s/t one -
08/01/07 @ 13:41
Comment from: saturnismine [Member]
i think malkmus isn't as highly regarded as pavement in the same way -- and for the same reasons -- that lots of artists outgrow the act that got them attention. pavement were on the crest of a particular late 80s to late 90s indie rock wave that was long in development, and tapered out with them, the same way kiss rode the crest of a glam / pop / hard rock / arena phenomenon. gene simmons and ace frehley could have put out their absolute SMARTEST versions of that music in the 80s as the refined their approach, but by then, the moment had passed. everything after "the moment" is viewed as either "not as good as..." or "a disappointment compared to...", "not as exciting as", even if clearer ears later on may see it as an advanced form of the stuff that got them famous.
malkmus hasn't really changed so much as evolved, matured. and the moment for "what it is that he does" has past. unless he was to totally reinvent himself and have a real impact with a totally different sound, he'll always live in the shadow of his early work, no matter how much more mature or refined his later stuff is.
that doesn't mean his later stuff isn't as good or better. it just means that when it's released, people will be less inclined to listen, and so will critics (in fact, i read some reviews of "face the truth" that make clear that the reviewer didn't actually listen, because he made mistakes and described down tempo numbers as "high octane", etc.. how embarrassing. but it's just further evidence of what i'm saying: people pay less attention once "the moment has passed, and there's no real evidence of a MAJOR change).
malkmus hasn't really changed so much as evolved, matured. and the moment for "what it is that he does" has past. unless he was to totally reinvent himself and have a real impact with a totally different sound, he'll always live in the shadow of his early work, no matter how much more mature or refined his later stuff is.
that doesn't mean his later stuff isn't as good or better. it just means that when it's released, people will be less inclined to listen, and so will critics (in fact, i read some reviews of "face the truth" that make clear that the reviewer didn't actually listen, because he made mistakes and described down tempo numbers as "high octane", etc.. how embarrassing. but it's just further evidence of what i'm saying: people pay less attention once "the moment has passed, and there's no real evidence of a MAJOR change).
08/01/07 @ 15:57
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Saturnismine wrote:
Obviously, they didn't - and can't that be significant? On the other hand, Van Morrison got his props for "growing into" the early promise of Them. The fact that he wasn't wildly popular in his youth might make his a different case, but there's got to be someone beside Paul Simon who fully fits this profile and who more than me and my shadow would agree actually improved, in some ways, as he or she became more comfortable with his or her approach.
Neil Young has been appreciated for growing into himself, at least up to a certain point. I've said before that, although the Velvet Underground are in just about every way "better" I sometimes "get more" out of solo Lou albums. There's something to take from the loss of innocence.
the same way kiss rode the crest of a glam / pop / hard rock / arena phenomenon. gene simmons and ace frehley could have put out their absolute SMARTEST versions of that music in the 80s as the refined their approach, but by then, the moment had passed
Obviously, they didn't - and can't that be significant? On the other hand, Van Morrison got his props for "growing into" the early promise of Them. The fact that he wasn't wildly popular in his youth might make his a different case, but there's got to be someone beside Paul Simon who fully fits this profile and who more than me and my shadow would agree actually improved, in some ways, as he or she became more comfortable with his or her approach.
Neil Young has been appreciated for growing into himself, at least up to a certain point. I've said before that, although the Velvet Underground are in just about every way "better" I sometimes "get more" out of solo Lou albums. There's something to take from the loss of innocence.
08/01/07 @ 16:03
Comment from: mwall [Member]
Richard Thompson maybe? Tough call. Early Fairport's great, but Thompson doesn't have his signature sound just yet. He pretty much does by Full House though, although his songwriting is still under construction, as great as some of those tunes are.
08/01/07 @ 17:10
Comment from: BigSteve [Member]
There's just something about bands that appeals to (especially young) people. I think it's that idealism that your close friends in high school and/or college will always be close, and the sensibility you develop in concert with each other really is uniquely meaningful. As`far as I can tell, much of Pavement's material really was arrived at by group jamming, even if Malkmus 'wrote' the words. Obviously those words don't always have any clear meaning, and I think the kind of insular sarcasm in those lyrics is very typical of smartass cliques everywhere.
Most people grow out of that phase, especially as they get real life girlfriends/wives or boyfriends/husbands. Malkmus' lyrics now are much more direct, and the playing by his band is more focused. But that doesn't necessarily translate into continued obsessive fandom. The sound of his voice will probably always trigger a warm response among listeners of a certain age group, but his music is unlikely ever to reach a wider audience than it has right now.
Most people grow out of that phase, especially as they get real life girlfriends/wives or boyfriends/husbands. Malkmus' lyrics now are much more direct, and the playing by his band is more focused. But that doesn't necessarily translate into continued obsessive fandom. The sound of his voice will probably always trigger a warm response among listeners of a certain age group, but his music is unlikely ever to reach a wider audience than it has right now.
08/01/07 @ 18:26
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Richard Thompson is a good example of what I'm talking about, Mwall.
BigSteve, Saturnismine, et al: good contributions as well!
BigSteve, Saturnismine, et al: good contributions as well!
08/01/07 @ 21:07
Comment from: BigSteve [Member]
Peter Gabriel also seems like a good example of an artist who outgrew his first band, and who has gone on to do work vastly superior both to what they've done and to what he could have done if he had stuck with the gang.
08/02/07 @ 08:14
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Gabriel is another good example, and he's been appreciated for his growth and maturity.
08/02/07 @ 08:54
Comment from: saturnismine [Member]
those ARE good examples (the neil and the thompson, and the gabriel).
we're thinking along the same lines, because i was also thinking last night in terms of this nick lowe album we were discussing a few weeks back....as the longer term example.
my mother was turned on to that album by a neighbor. she's totally unfamiliar with who nick lowe WAS. the notion that her teenaged son was listening to nick lowe and the various projects with which he was associated was completely weird to her. she couldn't even process it. for me, "nick lowe" is always going to be, at least in part, who he was. and i'm not nearly as thrilled by his new album as my mother is. and to her, "nick lowe" is only who he is right now.
malkmus, like anybody who continues to strum and write, could also continue to evolve to have a new musical life later, and gain a substantial appreciation in another genre, with another audience, etc..
we're thinking along the same lines, because i was also thinking last night in terms of this nick lowe album we were discussing a few weeks back....as the longer term example.
my mother was turned on to that album by a neighbor. she's totally unfamiliar with who nick lowe WAS. the notion that her teenaged son was listening to nick lowe and the various projects with which he was associated was completely weird to her. she couldn't even process it. for me, "nick lowe" is always going to be, at least in part, who he was. and i'm not nearly as thrilled by his new album as my mother is. and to her, "nick lowe" is only who he is right now.
malkmus, like anybody who continues to strum and write, could also continue to evolve to have a new musical life later, and gain a substantial appreciation in another genre, with another audience, etc..
08/02/07 @ 09:18
Comment from: BigSteve [Member]
And then there's Bryan Ferry, whose solo work, after he got past his covers period, is pretty much indistinguishable from late period Roxy. If we ever get to hear the promised new Roxy album, my guess is that it will sound pretty much like a Bryan Ferry album.
Does anyone have anything good to say about the Dylan covers album? You'd be hard pressed to find a bigger Roxy/Ferry fan than me, but I haven't benn able to make myself buy the damn thing.
Does anyone have anything good to say about the Dylan covers album? You'd be hard pressed to find a bigger Roxy/Ferry fan than me, but I haven't benn able to make myself buy the damn thing.
08/02/07 @ 09:22
Comment from: sally_cinnamon [Member]
Oh geez - I totally do have tracks from Face the Truth;) I was just listening to it and realized I must have heard it because of "It Kills" that IS an awesome song... Thanks for making me visit this album Mr. Mod - now playing:)
08/02/07 @ 10:35
Comment from: saturnismine [Member]
yeah, i think "it kills" resides is an emotional zone that malk rarely visited with pavement.
"no more shoes" may not be as dynamite as some of the lengthy jams on pig libs, but it rules in its own right, too.
but don't overlook those offebeat gems, either. when i saw them in rome, it was "pencil rot", "i've hardly been", and "kindling for the master" (requested by yours truly during a moment of onstage indecision) that brought the house down, not "no more shoes".
"no more shoes" may not be as dynamite as some of the lengthy jams on pig libs, but it rules in its own right, too.
but don't overlook those offebeat gems, either. when i saw them in rome, it was "pencil rot", "i've hardly been", and "kindling for the master" (requested by yours truly during a moment of onstage indecision) that brought the house down, not "no more shoes".
08/02/07 @ 10:58
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
I'm with you on the offbeat gems, Townsman Saturnismine. What's that one called, "Loud Crowd Cloud"? This will likely make some Pavement fans wretch, but it sounds like a cool Andy Partridge home demo.
08/02/07 @ 11:10
Comment from: dr. john [Member]
I think that solo Malkmus requires a whole different set of ears than Pavement. By that, I mean that Malkmus's ironic, smirky stance, that always bugged me, was counterbalanced by Kannenberg and Ibold.
Also, Kannenberg's songs were a nice refresher.
The stuff I've heard from Malkmus solo sounds really like prog-rock. He still has a tendency to bury what could be killer hooks, and his melodies tend to have that "Mr. Bojangles" phrasing. There is as well aimless instrumental passages.
No doubt that there is something interesting going on in a song like "It Kills." For me, though, I have to get past all the things I don't like about Malkmus to get to the cool stuff.
Also, Kannenberg's songs were a nice refresher.
The stuff I've heard from Malkmus solo sounds really like prog-rock. He still has a tendency to bury what could be killer hooks, and his melodies tend to have that "Mr. Bojangles" phrasing. There is as well aimless instrumental passages.
No doubt that there is something interesting going on in a song like "It Kills." For me, though, I have to get past all the things I don't like about Malkmus to get to the cool stuff.
08/02/07 @ 13:59
Comment feed for this postComments are not allowed from anonymous visitors.
