Jul 172009
Excluding Keith Moon, who lost control of his life, let his drumming magic slip, and then died prematurely, although not necessarily before the band’s greatness was well on the decline, which member of The Who did the most to damage the band’s run of powerful music making? Furthermore, without getting into a “jump the shark”-style discussion, when did this band member’s harmful influence on the band’s direction first lead to a turn for the worse?
I’m still thinking this one out, but I think it’s Roger’s fault.
Apparently, the ’73 Quadrophenia tour was a train wreck. The band was unable to play with the intricate backing tapes, which was necessitated because Rog vetoed Pete’s desire to hire an Oliver to fill out the sound. Funny, given how loaded with backing players The Who would wind up being. Plus, Daltrey insisted on explaining the story in between songs, which must’ve been a huge drag on momentum.
So I think that tour was the turning point. Subsequent tours, at least during the remaining Moon years, were strictly greatest-hits affairs. The band would go years without changing the set list. And album-wise, Quadrophenia was probably their last great or near-great album.
That sounds like a train wreck. Is there any film of that era?
I just saw the 1978 show DVD and it was OK but no Keith and they just kinda went through the motions.
The 1989 tour with session player overload and Pete in a glass box was strange. I was so damn happy to see them that I didn’t even care that it was The Who On Ice
Oh, the question: What member led to the downfall of the Who?
Daltrey – here’s why….
He loves The Who more than any man on Earth (way more than Pete) and is not able to move away from it. The rest of them would have called it quits ages ago. Roger needs The Who – it’s his identity, his paycheck, his song cannon, his art (of interpretation..since he does not really write or play an instrument), and his life skill (troubadour).
If anything, he gives his 100% even when the others do not…and sadly that makes for some “phoned in” Who moments, both on record and on stage.
I totally agree with jungleland2 on his take on the Rog, but I honestly think that Pete did more damage than anyone else.
Townshend has always been the identity of the band in the sense that his songs are the voice. If his songs fail, then the band fails. I think Who Are You was Pete’s last great attempt at making traditional “powerful” Who music. Who By Numbers was certainly more introspective (which I might consider a “turn for the worse” although I adore everything about that record) and many accuse him of keeping his best material after Who Are You for his own solo career (an argument I don’t buy). There are moments on the later records, but they definitely aren’t reaching like they were in the old days.
In essence of the question itself, I have to blame Pete Townshend for doing more damage than anyone. While it might fall on Rog and Ox as to the band reuniting numerous times after the “farewell tour”, I don’t knopw that those tours really damaged the creds of the band. I didn’t get to see The Who until 2000, and I understand jungle’s feelings of excitement even though I was likely seeing a shadow of the former band. The band may have been phoning it in, but as my friend Todd exclaimed during the first song, “Everything that is supposed to be happening is happening!”
I’m basing my opinion of the songs themselves and that falls more upon my man Pete’s shoulders than anyone else’s. While I may defend those later records to the end, I certainly can agree that they are not the same anthemic glory (re: “powerful music making”) of the earlier records.
TB
I say Townshend, during the Live at Leeds/Festival era. As a pot-smoking, 3-minute pop song visionary prior to the Festival era, the guy was a genius, with a band totally capable of pumping JUICE into his odd compositions. Then he dropped acid and signed onto the Hendrix Plan. The problen was, Townshend and his bandmates were not cut out for hippie guitar jams. There was nowhere to go with that Live at Leeds nonsense (even the at-least energetic aspects of it). The Who abandoned the hippie path before ever testing it out in the studio, but Townshend still wanted to go EPIC, so he strung out his ’60s compositions, strung them together, and hit paydirt with two albums, Who’s Next and Quadrophenia. In the meantime, however, Daltrey lost much of his macho cool standing as Pete’s Rock Prophet status grew. Entwistle got lost up his own pointy bass collection. Moon couldn’t stop playing the endless fills from Live at Leeds.
I don’t agree with your reasons, Mod, but I DO agree with your choice of Towsers as the culprit. To me, the reason is as simple as this: he got sick of it. Most of the songs on The Who by Numbers were about what a drag it was to be Pete Townshend. When they finally got back together to do Who Are You, his writing was, for the most part, more suitable for *him* as a solo artist, than The Who as a band.I get the distinct impression that he was keeping it going partially out of some sense of responsibility to the other 3. Apart from Entwhistle, *who* I’m sure could have made it alone on his musicianship
HEY! I wasn’t finished!!! What I was going to say before the gremlins posted what I was in the middle of writing was, Daltrey, I don’t think, would have fared that well, as he was always best when he was singing Pete’s songs. Moon, even if he had been able to get himself under control, wasn’t really suited to play with another band (I’ve made my case for the idiosyncratic nature of the band’s style of instrumental interaction in earlier threads). Anyway, whether or not I’m right about any of that, I DO think I’m right about Pete being tired of The Who as his primary outlet, yet he kept it going way past it’s sell-by date, complaining all the while, yet unable to let it go, for whatever reasons. Yeah, I’m sticking with laying blame on Townshend, for letting it go on past Who Are You, which wasn’t very good, but I’d allow them *that* misstep. They had a perfect “out” when Moon died, but didn’t take it, & it didn’t do anyone much good, especially fans.
BB,
You pointed out years ago the funny line that goes something like, “Let me tell you a little more about myself” from one of those slow piano songs on The Who By Numbers. Don’t remember which one. Yeah, that was the Boo Hoo, I’m Pete Townshend phase.
ChuckenFrank, Actually THAT line is off his solo record, the awkwardly titled, “All The Best Cowboys Have Chinese Eyes”. I do remember YOU pointing out (much to my Who-worshiping chagrin) that “How Many Friends” off “The Who By Numbers” sounded like some kind of self esteem tune from Sesame Street!
The cat spent a good 10 years writing “Poor Me” songs, with & w/out The Who, & to varying degrees of success.
To whoever said Daltrey couldn’t play an instrument:
Dude! You don’ know how wrong you are. I had the good fortune to see Daltrey take over on lead guitar after Townshend impaled his hand doing a windmill, and I gotta tell ya, Roger smoked. One of my all-time fave RAWK memories.
There has got to be video or audio evidence of this somewheres on the intranet…
Ooohh, and wasn’t Daltrey the High Numbers original lead guitarist?
Yes, jeangrey, you are correct, madam. He *was* the original ld gtr player, in the original band that included Townshend, Daltrey, & Entwhistle. He also plays a pretty serviceable harp, when called upon.
BUT….It was still PETE’s fault!!! BTW, we all seem to forget that these guys are capable of more than their assigned tasks w/in their bands. After all, Jagger came up with the riff to “Brown Sugar”.
I see from looking up his acting on imdb.com that Daltrey has an Untitled Keith Moon Project in development.
Marshall, that thing has been talked about for a while now. It’s one of those things like the Pet Sounds box set: I’ll believe it when I actually see it. Daltrey’s been trying to make that fly for a very very long time.
TB