Comment from: Oats [Member]
The third is for fans of Absolutely Fabulous.

Time for a comedy-nerd pince nez. "Handbags and Gladrags" was the theme to The Office (the original UK version, obviously.
06/21/08 @ 20:29
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Isn't that what I wrote?:) I was thinking it "also" sounded like the music on The Office! I think yesterday's Brian Auger Trinity/Julie Driscoll video was stuck in my head. They were the ones who do the version of "This Wheel's On Fire" from AbFab, right?
06/21/08 @ 20:39
Comment from: latelydavidband [Member] Email · http://msbluestrailblog.blogspot.com/
You are right, Mod. "This Wheel's On Fire" from AbFab is Driscoll/Auger.

TB
06/21/08 @ 21:32
Comment from: mwall [Member] Email
This first post rocks, Mod. I like this comparison by year even though I can see how it could end up having shortcomings. I would only add that the "body shots" of covering Dylan and the Stones also show the continued devotion of the apprentice trying to find a way out from underneath the power of the master. In lit studies they call this "anxiety of influence" and I think that's a concept that you could really run with in this showdown.
06/21/08 @ 22:06
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Mwall, feel free to educate us further on this devotion of apprentice concept. Sounds like it could help the discussion.

The year-by-year comparisons that I plan to examine definitely need to take into consideration the body shots. I wouldn't be surprised f there is a round that seems to lean ever so slightly to one contestant but that will be judged the opposite way owing to damage in previous rounds. For the first round, though, it's tough to beat Let It Bleed!
06/21/08 @ 22:09
Comment from: BigSteve [Member] Email
I think I may have the honor of being the first townsman to pince nez TB.

This Wheel's on Fire was a British hit in 1968 for Julie Driscoll with Brian Auger and The Trinity. Driscoll recorded the song again in the early '90s as a duet with Adrian Edmondson as the theme to Absolutely Fabulous. (Does Auger play on this? I can't find anything that says he did.) In any case the version that is used on the show is not the Auger/Driscoll recording from '68.

Edmondson had a small recurring role on the show as the restaurant critic at the magazine Patsy worked at. He is more famous for having played the immortal Vyvyan on The Young Ones, and he's also married to AbFab star Jennifer Saunders.
06/21/08 @ 23:50
Comment from: BigSteve [Member] Email
Back in the day a friend had that First Step album, and I always thought it had a cool sound. At the time I was a budding slide player, and Woody plays slide almost exclusively on that record. I like their version of Wicked Messenger.

That version of Street Fighting Man is a bit of a mess though, isn't it? And the engineer must have been loaded. It sounds awful. Micky Waller could really pack a wallop.

But if we're trying to stack them up against the Stones, I don't think they're in the same league. In my opinion Gimme Shelter has a legitimate claim to be the greatest rock song/track ever. It's ambitious on a level the Faces can't even imagine, and it succeeds in every way.

In comparison the Faces at this point are inspired amateurs.
06/22/08 @ 00:18
Comment from: latelydavidband [Member] Email · http://msbluestrailblog.blogspot.com/
You got me, Steve. I shall admit defeat. But just to prove my nerdiness (or my Elvis Costello creds), Ade Edmonson directed the video for "This Town."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlFJjPxylO4

Now, back to the Royale!

TB
06/22/08 @ 00:50
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Beware of rushing to judgment based on 1 song in 1 year, BigSteve. There will be ample time to discuss issues of "amateurism" and whether that's a help or a hinderance in terms of discussing either band during our given time frame.
06/22/08 @ 01:42
Comment from: BigSteve [Member] Email
Well, the Stones are fully formed by 1969 and at the height of their powers. The Faces are still trying to figure out what they're doing. There's more material because there's a Rod solo album too, so it might seem like there's a lot to counter-balance what the Stones have to offer. What I'm saying is that Gimme Shelter and You Can't Always Get What You Want have enough weight to offset all Rod and the Faces have.

We'll see what happens as Rod and the boys come into their own.
06/22/08 @ 05:13
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
I hear you, BigSteve.
06/22/08 @ 08:29
Comment from: mwall [Member] Email
Mwall, feel free to educate us further on this devotion of apprentice concept. Sounds like it could help the discussion.


Sure. Just for the record, Harold Bloom's book The Anxiety of Influence defines seven ways that apprentice writers try to overcome their (self-selected) masters. Actually his ideas are mostly bullshit but the general concept has had more staying power.

In this case I think we could narrow it to three possibilities:

1) The apprentice wants to be the master ("I wish I'd been the lead singer on the Stones' 'Street Fighting Man'").

2) The apprentice wishes to conquer the master ("We were on a live bill with them and kicked their asses" or "We put out a better album this year than they did"). I think Stewart has a shot for some glory in this category. After all, even though the NBA Finals Playoff Rivalry stands, I believe, at 10-2, nonetheless The Lakers have beaten, and even dominated, the Celtics sometimes.

3) The apprentice displaces the master on the apprentice's own terms ("When I play my music, no one will ever think of the Rolling Stones again."). Here, Rod has no shot. To be fair, this one is really difficult to do. Just the mere fact of having been born after the great artist makes it nearly impossible--for instance it's not your fault, Mod, that you were born after the Beatles, but it is your burden. But it is possible, though, to achieve #3. I would maintain for instance that the Stones themselves achieved this; in listening to them, we don't immediately have to think about Chuck Berry or Muddy Waters. It's a cool question for historians but not much more.
06/22/08 @ 11:35
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
Thanks, Mwall. Good stuff, and yes, it will help frame this examination.

For the record, the fault of my having been born after the Beatles had never been in question until this point.
06/22/08 @ 14:22
Comment from: geo [Member] Email
I wanted to mention that although "Let It Bleed" could be used as a marker for the beginning of "Mick Taylor Era Stones", the reality is that it was more a continuation of post-Brian Jones Burnout Stones. Taylor shows up on only one song, "Live With Me" and the guitars reflect the strengths and weaknesses of Keith's style. It's a much more rickety sound than the earlier released Honky-Tonk Women, which I believe Taylor did play on or the later Sticky Fingers which is much more solid sounding in the guitar area.
06/22/08 @ 19:49
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
I think Taylor is on two songs, but thanks for pointing that out. If Sticky Fingers is an improvement, I'm not buying. But let's not rush ahead of ourselves.
06/22/08 @ 21:44
Comment from: 2000 Man [Member] Email
Mod, I hope Rod has something big up his sleeve. If we're seriously looking at light blows that may come back to hurt more later, then at the moment, Rod can't spell his own name and he thinks you're holding up eleventeen fingers. Let It Bleed is one of the great rock albums. There's only a handful of albums that are even in the same league, and they're by people like The Beatles, Dylan and Rolling Stones. Rod has never been associated with an album as original and influential as Let It Bleed.
06/22/08 @ 23:06
Comment from: shawnkilroy [Member] Email
handbags and gladrags

holy crap

that"s good!
06/23/08 @ 02:28
Comment from: Mr. Moderator [Member]
2K, I made it clear that Let It Bleed won Round 1 by a landslide. The judges made up their mind before Rod took his robe off, but that's just one round. Hold tight. Things may get interesting.
06/23/08 @ 09:30
Comment from: geo [Member] Email
I don't think Sticky Fingers is an improvement over Let It Bleed. I just think the guitar approach is much less idiosyncratic on the later album. Not that that's a good thing, necessarily.
06/24/08 @ 22:30

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